Published Works
Reviewed works
Interview
Profile
Emma Restall Orr is a teacher and priestess with, arguably, one of the highest profiles of any Druid in the world today. She is a spokesperson for Druidry in the media as head of the international Druid Network, Chief of the Order of the Yew, and former Joint Chief of the British Druid Order. She teaches courses worldwide, and lectures at universities and conferences on Druidry, environmentalism, healing, and women's spirituality.
Emma founded Honouring the Ancient Dead, an advocacy group for ancient British human remains, looking at how they are and should be treated by archaeologists, museums and other heritage bodies. She founded and runs the Druid Camp with Mark Graham, held in the Forest of Dean - the largest gathering of Druids annually.
Profile updated: 7 June 2007
Websites:
The Druid Network http://druidnetwork.org
What is Druidry http://www.whatisdruidry.org
Honouring the Ancient Dead http://www.honour.org.uk
The Druid Camp http://druidcamp.org.uk
Published Works
Books:
in chronological order, with the earliest first
Spirits of the Sacred Grove (Thorsons/Harper Collins, 1998) rereleased as Druid Priestess (Thorsons/Harper Collins, 2000)
Principles of Druidry (Thorsons/Harper Collins, 1998 : now available on http://www.whatisdruidry.org)
Ritual : A Guide to Life, Love and Inspiration (Thorsons/Harper Collins, 2000)
First Directions - Druidry (Thorsons/Harper Collins, 2000)
A Druid Directory written with Phililp Shallcrass (British Druid Order, 2001)
Druidry : Rekindling the Sacred Fire written with Philip Shallcrass (British Druid Order, 2002)
Living Druidry : Magical Spirituality for the Wild Soul (Piatkus, 2004)
"The Ethics of Paganism : The Value and Power of Sacred Relationship" article contributed plus joint editor of Pagan Visions (Llewellyn, 2005)
The Apple and the Thorn, written with Bill Melnyk (Thoth, 2007) (http://www.theappleandthethorn.com)
Living with Honour : A Pagan Ethics (O Books, April 2008)
Kissing the Hag : The Dark Goddess and the Unacceptable Nature of Woman (O Books, October 2008)
Current Projects :
Consciousness : The Self in an Integrated World
Other Than in English:
Druidismo (Armenia, Milan 1999)
Druidismo (Hi Brasil, Sao Paolo 2000)
Ritual (Hi Brasil, Sao Paolo 2000) Druidenweisheit (Urania, Germany 2001)
Poetry:
Black Lizard Forest (British Druid Order, 1997)
Tides of Dying (British Druid Order, 1999)
Music:
Hush (1998)
Latest releases are available in good bookstores. Most are available from the author.
Contact the author
General Interivews
E-zine Echoed Voices on http://www.echoedvoices.org/Mar2003/Emma_Orr.html. Since there has been problems recently in accessing the Echoed Voices website the interview has been reproduced on this site here.
There is also an earlier interview with EMMA RESTALL ORR talking to Aldwyn Draigh when she was joint chief of the British Druid Order on Echoed Voices page http://www.echoedvoices.org/Oct2001/OctOrrInterview.html. Again, in view of difficulties accessing Echoed Voices the interview is reproduced here.
Bobcat talks to Syd Merle, French Members' Coordinator for The Druid Network : in English or in French.
Kindred Spirit Magazine, http://www.kindredspirit.co.uk/ARTICLES/4806_druidry.asp
Pagan Vegetarian http://www.paganveg.com/livingwithhonour.html
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Interview
Interviewer: Christine Cleere
Interview date: 1 Mar 2004
What makes someone a Druid?
My instinctive answer would be: absolute dedication and a great deal of hard work. Yet, though I say it with a smile, that isn't enough. For it is possible to pour an incredible amount of energy into a task and never quite grasp the point.
My second answer approaches the question a little more obliquely: being a Druid is ever essentially an aspiration. Using any label is fraught with complications and limitations, yet to me the word 'Druid' is an ancient and powerful invocation. So what is the Druid aspiring to?
To some extent this depends upon the individual's vision. From my work within the tradition, I feel that my own is common across most of mainstream Druidry. What we aspire to is the ability to live honourably, with care and respect, with relevance and responsibility, through our profound reverence for nature both within us and around us.
Having said that, there is value in the historical sense of the Druid being the priest of nature. We may simply celebrate within the Druid community, we may be a student of the tradition, we may find ourselves gaining sufficient skills in order to call ourselves Bard, then Ovate, but it is only when we have studied for very many years that there is a validity in using for ourselves the word 'Druid'.
Skills is a key word too. For simply reading a stack of books or attending the odd ritual or workshop does not make a Bard, nor an Ovate nor Druid. It is about action, about how we behave, taking that reverence for nature into every step and every breath. What makes a Druid, and what measures a Druid, then, is the way that a person lives their life.
Why did you start The Druid Network?
Having spent some twelve years working for The Order of Bards Ovates and Druids, then The British Druid Order, I was finding myself increasingly frustrated by a number of issues.
With any membership organization, there is inherent and often encouraged a sense of 'us' and 'them'. Power games arise, political issues erupt, as people seek out ways of moving through an apparent or recognized hierarchy. Competition and cliquishness develop between organizations. None of this felt compatible with Druidry.
One of the foundation stones of The Druid Network was to establish and develop an organization that was Druidic through and through, and it is. Based on Druid ethics, there is no hierarchy, no politics, just a network of good relationships as people come together to resource the Druid community world-wide.
It was also important to me to detach administrative/financial issues from core spiritual practice. The Druid Network deals with the practicalities of the tradition - what books to read, how to find a priest or Grove, environmental volunteering and protest, and so on. All of these are resources for individuals and groups, regardless of memberships, affiliations or initiations, and regardless of where and with whom they explore their own deep spiritual practice.
Perhaps most importantly, however, I have a clear sense that we learn our greatest lessons in Druidry both from life itself and from each other. In my books I hope to inspire others, but I don't pretend to teach anything. In workshops, courses and with my students, I am a guide, teaching only the frameworks of practice, sharing ideas for deepening sacred connection. The Druid Network was set up in order to give the whole Druid community opportunities to meet or correspond with others across the board in the tradition, so sharing their experience, ideas and wisdom. We are all teachers, we are all students.
You talk about inspiration as a foundation stone of Druidry. What inspires you?
Relationship. A vast swathe of me is feline, craving solitude and certainly seldom ever seeking out company. Yet what inspires me is still complete and exquisitely focused connection. I find that primarily, and essentially, in my relationship with the natural world around me, with the mud beneath my feet (or paws), the wind on my nose, the trees of the forest here where I live, the flowers of the meadows, the occasional blackbird, badger or butterfly.
The concept that Druids call Awen, divine inspiration, I find within these perfectly connecting relationships, when soul touches soul, when life force meets life force, with recognition, wonder, honesty and respect. Energy of life surges through us, breaking up our preconceptions and expectations, leaving us naked and utterly awake. As an animist, I perceive the spirit of every creature, from pebbles to pussy cats, and my Druidcraft is a glorious adventure of creating and deepening sacred and honourable relationship with those around me in a perpetual quest for inspiration.
Of course, there are also the handful of human beings who are close to me, and being ever wakeful to those relationships is equally inspiring, allowing me to explore the powers of human nature, the streams of life, its eddies and quirks of flow. Those close relationships also feed my craving for awen, my hunger for beauty, as souls meet, in perfect honesty.
Questing awen in a more potent form, I reach for deity, perhaps the goddess into whom I most frequently dissolve my soul - the endless darkness of the universe - or some other power of nature, such as wind or rain or wild emotion. Yes, that inspires me ... in an ecstatic mind-blowing supernova sort of way.
I am told that you object strongly to monotheism. Why?
It would be more accurate to say that I object to monism: the focus on 'one'. As a priest of nature, I see beauty in the diversity of the natural world, in chaos and pattern, in individuality and cohesion, in harmony and discord. I am wholly polytheistic, tending towards relativism and pluralism, acknowledging the specific power of each unique moment in time and space.
As a result, I feel any spirituality that proclaims itself the 'one truth' is both offensive and baffling. This is equally true within fundamentalist Paganisms as in monotheisms, and in politics, philosophy, science, psychology, economics and aesthetics. I feel that it is the poignance of relationship that informs us of truth, through relevance and reverence, not the declaration or acceptance of another's vision.
All forms of monism - whether in political dictatorships, trade monopolies, or monotheistic spiritualities - are detrimental within all of nature, body and soul. They are born of a need for control and power, and they are sustained by force, oppression and fear. Diversity is crucial to health and sustainability.
Philosophically, monism speaks of an understanding of 'oneness' in terms of the stuff of life. This more pantheistic perspective is easier to accept than the dualism which so rigidly divides matter from spirit, black from white, man from woman, right from wrong. Yet, while certainly advocating a wholeness, my vision is not of a 'oneness': the energy which underlies all existence is the smallest building block, not the supreme sentience, not the largest. The power of nature is in the way that every tiny element is perfectly connected.
So no, I don't object to monotheism: I object to intolerance. Interfaith dialogue is critically important and an issue I spend a good deal of time on. I am intrigued by others' perceptions of the sacred and profound, of morality and honour. However, from a polytheistic perspective, I find the blinkered evangelism and bigoted judgmentalism that seeps out of fundamentalist Judaism, Christianity and Islam (and Paganism) both deeply saddening and extremely offensive.
Thankfully, there are an increasing number within monotheistic traditions who are beginning to understand the invalidity of their limited perspective. It is always a pleasure to work alongside another soul committed to the sacred in nature and the wonder of life, whatever his religion or concept of deity.
Many Pagans seem to believe that gods are useful archetypes that don't really exist. Do you agree?
I don't agree. If the gods, and indeed spirits of nature, are considered merely archetypes or constructs of the human mind, there is no possibility for relationship. As in most modern psycho-babble, we are left exploring our navels, projecting and reflecting, alone.
Neither are gods or spirits wisps of magic, ethereal and intangible yet all powerful entities that we must believe in. That is the other side of the coin and equally unhelpful. One of the beautiful things about Druidry for me is that you don't need to believe in anything. No superstitions, no implausible promises, no incredible angels. Its power is in natural experience.
My gods are forces of nature: wind, rain, forest, sea, valley, mountain, sun, darkness. Human nature flows with divine energy too: the gods are those of love, rage, lust, hunger, mischief and more. Then there are the gods who weave the two together, our ancestral gods whose journeys are held in mythology and folklore.
It is the fact that I can make powerfully sacred and ecstatic relationships with my gods that teaches me, guiding me upon the path of Druidry. Without that, I may as well watch television.
I've heard that your Grove has a vegetarian, drug-free policy? Isn't that rather extreme?
There are plenty of times and places when people can indulge in their drugs of choice, and it isn't up to me to judge where or how they do it. However, a Tangwen's Grove gathering is a sacred occasion. Our rites can be profound, with laughter and tears, initiating deep change through soul-naked reverence, a time to share clarity, honesty and respect. It is no place for drugs that muddy perception.
As for vegetarian, though there are meat-eaters in the Grove, its gatherings are a place where people express care and consideration for others. When we share food at the feast, most Tangwen Grove folk bring dishes that everyone can eat. There is particular care to avoid any animal products, and care taken with gluten, sugar, nuts, GMO, with plenty of organic products, local produce and so on. So do we truly share.
If you are asking me if I am a militant in these areas, the answer is probably yes. Having been vegan for some 20 years, I now find it hard to be around meat and can no longer understand the meat-eater's justifications. My vows are not that I shall not kill, but about unnecessary harm. In this respect, being vegan is only a part of what I consider to be honourable interaction. Decreasing food consumption is important, using local/organic foods, avoiding GMO and so on. We must look too at the pharmaceuticals we use, toiletries, household products, clothes: everything! Druidry requires us to care.
As for drugs, I've written about this in my latest book, Living Druidry. All natural substances that alter the brain's chemicals are sacred and must only be used as such. In the Grove, we share whisky or mead, or the like, each person taking just a sip or two, honouring our ancestors and the divine power that brings this momentary yet ancient gift of fire in the belly. It is ritual, not recreational; it teaches us instead of allowing us to turn away.
I have heard people criticize you for being anti-intellectual. Are you?
This is a criticism that I've heard from two sources. Firstly from pompous pseudo-intellectuals (some may have heard me on the BBC Radio 4 programme, The Moral Maze in December 2003), for whom the idea of a natural spirituality is impossible to comprehend. If there aren't written scriptures, a hierarchical church and one god, it is assumed that what is left is anarchic, simplistic, primitive and mindless. It's an attitude that expresses an undiluted ignorance about the power of deep relationship that underlies Druidry.
The second source is from those who intellectualize Druidry. I make no attempt to write from a genderless standpoint, exploring my spirituality as a woman, and as a result a good deal of what I speak about is rich with emotion and intuition, the darkness of the womb. When I came to Druidry in the 1980s it was overrun with men pondering their navels, celebrating their intellect in what felt to me to be a fiesta of tedium and theory. I have thoroughly enjoyed bringing the wild back into Druidry and many have thanked me for it.
So no, I am far from anti-intellectual. Druidry reveres nature, and that includes human nature. Our intellect is a powerful guide. We must listen to it, as we must listen to our emotions and our physicality.
There is an obvious leaning towards the dark in your work. Can you explain why?
The fact that I do focus is to a large extent about my own nature and experience. All my life I've dealt with acute pain, and as this genetic nerve disorder catches up on me I am increasingly finding teachings in the darkness.
The dark is gorgeous. Embracing, it offers us emptiness, the freedom from the past and future, the opportunity to explore potential. Formless and infinite, it shows us our fears and our limitations. It is the celebration of mystery and the silence of being.
My focus is also a rejection of the concept that knowledge is all-important and necessarily of value in itself, and so relates to the previous question. I feel that there can be equal power and freedom in mystery, intuition and not knowing everything.
People who attend your workshops and courses sometimes remark that you are a fierce teacher, as do your apprentices. Can you comment on your approach?
Yes, it is said that I am uncompromising and that I push people hard. Yet many who come for teaching are desperate to find deep connection with nature and deity. What is stopping them are the barricades of their own fear and apathy, and so most often what I am doing is encouraging them to get wild and break out of the box.
I yell, 'Daily practice!' and 'Commitment!' and 'Wake up!', and slowly folk begin to find trust, letting down the defensive walls, and beginning to touch and be touched, to listen and to sing, to see and respect, and to walk with each step a prayer.
Implicit is an understanding that Druidry is about learning how to connect. Once we are able to do it ourselves, every stone and leaf and butterfly, every raindrop, every other human being, becomes a teacher. Until then, life is cluttered.
So yes, I can be fierce. I love to watch people wake, crash out of the box of their own limitations, and stretch, grow, blooming in their exquisite freedom and creativity.
What inspires you to write books?
I've been a compulsive writer all my life. When I'm thinking or dreaming, I often do so as if I were writing, spinning a narrative in my mind, weaving dialogue. I've always written poetry and journals. I love language and words, and spend hours meandering through dictionaries. I'm a grammar geek! It has been a delight to be able to spill that soul-creativity so actively into my spiritual practice.
What inspired me to write my first book on Druidry, however, was simply that I felt there were none that I expressed my experience and understanding of the tradition. Though there are more books out there now, the choice is still thin, which is gently inspiring me to think about another.
You have now published 3 books on Druidry. Spirits of the Sacred Grove was rereleased as Druid Priestess, and Principles of Druidry also came out as an illustrated version, Directions: Druidry. Ritual, A Guide to Life, Love and Inspiration was also successful. Which would you recommend for whom and why?
Of the above, Spirits of the Sacred Grove (Druid Priestess) is my favourite and I'm pleased that it is still in print. Though it was written in 1997, which seems a lifetime ago, and though I wrote it far more gently than I would write it today, most of it I still feel to be true and of value. It is a very personal book; I wanted to share my own experience of the tradition and hopefully in doing so inspire others into the journey.
The other books were my publisher's idea. Indeed, when I was asked to write Principles, I wondered if my editor had actually read my first book, for she was asking me to do exactly what I'd clearly stated was impossible: succinctly to define the tradition. It is now out of print, which is a shame because it did offer a vision of Druidry that was easily accessible.
Ritual was also a commissioned book, but a pleasurable challenge to undertake: to write a valid book on ritual for a tradition that has no liturgy. I hope it is still of value as a resource offering an understanding of the nature of ritual, its purpose and its framework, that allows the reader to explore and deepen their own practice. I wanted it to be useful regardless of the reader's own spirituality. It is still available through The Druid Network, though out of print.
Your new book, Living Druidry, is due to be released in June 2004. Why another book and what's this one about?
Through the last three years after releasing Ritual, I wrote a good deal on sexuality, creativity and acceptability, but they were difficult years running The British Druid Order and supporting Philip Shallcrass while his wife fought and lost her battle with cancer. An extraordinary book emerged (known as Kissing the Hag), but it still needs work before publication. I don't feel any urgency in life; the days come and go. Before I get back to that book, however, I was inspired by a number of people to write Living Druidry.
In many ways, it is an updated version of Druid Priestess. Darker, richer, and more distinctly focused on inspiration, sacred relationship, theology and creativity, it is written in the same way, weaving anecdotes and narrative. No doubt it will create a fuss, many folk disagreeing with my perspective. Yet I'm sure many will relate to it too, finding splashes of themselves in the pages, empathizing and emoting with me. I hope it will provoke thought.
It will be the last time I attempt to summarize Druidry in a book.
Do you plan to publish more books in the future?
I am taking a break for a while, as my son transitions from a lifetime of home education into grammar school and GCSEs in September 2004. However, I have projects in the pipeline, including another book in progress called Pagan Ethics. I expect this one will cause a storm, which will be utterly delightful.
In time, I intend to return to Kissing the Hag, and I've always said I'd write a book on parenting. We'll see how my health and inspiration holds out. Perhaps I'll give up the pen and pour all my energy into music.
Tell us about your music.
Like my relationship with the fey, the sidhe or faerie, this isn't something I speak of often, perhaps because it is such an important part of my life and a part that is not public. Having said that, we (HUSH) did release a CD a few years ago and have been meaning to put together another for a long time. It will happen.
Music for me is an expression of deep emotion, even more so perhaps than poetry, and I am a soul with a very deep well of emotion. That doesn't mean I'm an emotional person, I seldom cry, I'm seldom angry (except with politicians). But what I do feel, I feel extremely deeply, and my music is a way of expressing that, with honour and creativity.
What really matters to you?
The simple answer is love. I'd add to that honesty and honour. I try to fill my life with all these three, and with every passing moon I learn more about their power and beauty. I appreciate it dearly when I perceive them in others.
Everything sits upon that foundation of love, honesty and honour: my spirituality, my environmentalism and my ethics as a human being. That's what really matters.
Oh, and good olives, with plenty of chili pepper and garlic.
And David Bowie.
